“Questions and Answers”
September 30th, 2007
OM… OM… OM…
Sai Ram
With Pranams at the Lotus Feet of Bhagavan,
Dear Brothers and Sisters!
Before I proceed with today’s topic, I happily welcome any questions that you might have. Any questions please? So questions are out of question now! (Laughter) Good.
Sir, please come here so that all will be benefited.
Sai Ram. If everything happens according to God’s Will, where is the need for effort from our side to change or do anything?
Thank you, sir. You are from?
Hyderabad.
Oh, good! Nice question: If everything happens according to God’s will, what are we supposed to do? What is it that I can do because, whether I do or not, God’s will, will prevail. God’s will is bound to happen. So what is the role of my effort? What am I to do? Am I in a state of helplessness?
No, my friends! What is effort? The only effort in this regard is to accept whatever happens unconditionally. That is the effort we have to make. God may have willed you to be successful in life, to take certain challenges in life, or even some failures which are unavoidable. The only effort we can make in life is to prepare ourselves for anything that happens and accept unconditionally whatever is given to us as the Divine gift.
But in reality, whatever be God’s will, we tend to take it from a worldly point of view. We have different experiences in life - pleasure and pain. We say that God willed life to be painful. We say that God willed life to be enjoyable. But the truth is that God willed neither pleasure nor pain for you.
God is non-dual. God transcends pain and pleasure. So, our effort is to transcend the dualistic experiences and go beyond pain and pleasure. Our effort is to not be affected by pain and pleasure. That is our effort.
Finally, our effort is to know that the Self is a witness to the dualistic experiences. The Self that experiences the pleasure is the same as the Self that experiences the pain. Pain and pleasure are experienced by the same Self, which is not affected by either of these. Our effort is to know the Self as a witness.
Therefore, our effort is to accept things unconditionally, joyfully, willingly. Our effort is not to get carried away by the dualistic experiences. Above all, our effort is to know that the Self is a witness to different experiences. Am I clear sir? Thank you.
Any more questions, please? Yes, sir. Please come over here. Oh, I am so glad. Sorry for making you come here, but it is so that you can use the microphone so that all can hear and be benefited. You are from?
Kerala.
Oh, from Kerala, where there is highest rate of literacy.
What is the significance of Bhagavan taking this ailment upon His body? Is it for welfare of any human beings? Is there any philosophical explanation for this?
Thank you, sir. This question is often put to me, whenever I meet big or small groups. I don’t go into philosophical depth or spiritual significance of this particular event. The question is how do you look at the present situation of Bhagavan being in a wheelchair? Further, this gentleman wants to understand why He has taken this ailment upon Himself. Has He any aim, such as human welfare, in accepting the present ailment?
My friends, the purpose of an Avatar is to teach. The purpose of an Avatar is to demonstrate. The aim of an Avatar is to set an example. To set an example, to demonstrate and to teach are the three-dimensional objectives of every Avatar. Baba, while walking briskly then, had a message to convey. Baba, in a wheelchair today, also has a message to convey. We have a lesson to learn -- then, now and forever.
If we look at it physically, the sight of Swami in a wheelchair is very painful. Some ladies even cry because it is a very sensitive matter. Some question as to why He should be in that state. Some even doubt His Divinity. Some will feel badly that, while He cures everybody, why does He not cure Himself? Some people go to the other extreme. When He cannot cure Himself, how is He going to cure me? (Laughter)
These are the questions that arise in our mind. There is no point in condemning anybody. There is no point in calling anybody less devoted or an atheist. There is no point in asking him to leave Prashanti Nilayam. You may ask one individual to leave, but there will be millions like that. So let us try to understand together. Let us try to explore together this particular question.
I think there are a few lessons that we should learn from Swami in a wheelchair. The first lesson I think is the spirit of acceptance, as we already discussed. He has accepted the condition; therefore He prefers to be in a wheelchair.
Two years ago, He was on a wheelchair. There in Kodaikanal some boys said, “Swami, we have a modern, sophisticated wheelchair where people don’t see the wheels. You can sit majestically on it and go.” They cried.
Swami said, “No. Bring that ordinary wheelchair.”
Baba also added, “People come to see Me and not My chair. People don’t come here to see the wheelchair. They come here to see Me!” (Laughter) That’s what Baba said. So, it only means that He has accepted that.
This is a lesson to all of us. We have to learn to accept the reality, the fundamental fact. Yes, there is a fracture; ok I accept it. There is no point in searching for another reason, another pretext.
Secondly, He said that it happened in the natural course of events. He has not taken anybody’s ailment upon Himself. If He tells us that He has taken so-and-so’s ailment, we will finish that person the next moment. (Laughter) So He has made it categorically clear that He has not taken on anybody’s ailment. It has happened in the natural course of events.
Further, He gave one example. If anyone slips on soap in the bathroom, he is sure to fall, whether God or an ordinary human being. Laws of gravitation operate for God also. He is not above the laws of Nature.
He also said that a policeman sees to it that we abide by traffic rules and drive on the left side, not on the right. In the U.S., it is the right side; here it is left side. But the policeman who enforces this rule cannot himself drive on the right side: “I am the policeman so I’ll drive on the right side.” No! You are also supposed to drive on the left side.
Therefore, God, who creates these natural laws, has to abide by His own laws. He has set the law and He has to unscrupulously abide by His own law. That is the second lesson. “When I am bound to suffer, it’s alright! There’s nothing wrong with it.”
The third lesson is that He doesn’t show any trace of pain on His face. In contrast, in our case, any simple problem we have, whether a family problem or a community problem, we make it a national problem if possible! (Laughter) A simple headache or stomach ache is enough to impose curfew at home! “Nobody should see TV, nobody should talk, nobody should joke, nobody should smile, and no guests please because I have a headache!” (Laughter) So, we share our headache with everybody. We don’t leave anybody until they also get a headache! (Laughter)
But here is Bhagavan who never says that He is in any pain. He says nothing at all! He says that He has no pain at all and shares happiness with everybody with His broad smile, kind gestures, and words of enquiry. This is a lesson to all of us to swallow all our problems. So sharing happiness with everyone around is the third lesson.
The fourth lesson that we have to learn is this. Any simple problem makes us apply for a casual leave. One gentleman who was poor in English wrote in his application: “I am suffering from the marriage of my daughter; therefore, grant me casual leave.” (Laughter)
Everybody laughed. Suffering? Well, he happened to be my friend. He is correct about suffering because he had to pay lot of dowry (Laughter). Also, he had to extend all hospitalities and extra courtesies to the groom’s family. Therefore, he had to suffer. So he is correct.
And here Baba has a hectic schedule right from morning to evening: talking to people, granting interviews, giving darshans, guiding and chiding, directing, admonishing, and praising people. That schedule has never been changed for any reason. If it were you or me, we would apply for casual leave. “I have a headache; therefore, I am sorry, but kindly grant me casual leave.” Baba has never applied for casual leave for even a day.
Then we may question why sometimes darshan is cancelled. Let me share with you a Divine secret, which I am not supposed to. I know I am taking a risk. It always happens in my life. (Laughter) I can’t avoid it. So many interviews are taking place at His residence today. If I get an opportunity, I would say, “Swami, what’s all this?”
He talks to many people there at the residence. It is not that He wants to avoid us. Important matters, policy matters are discussed. Therefore, Swami is not on a holiday when darshan is cancelled. No! He is busier on the days the darshan is cancelled. He is so busy that He has to cancel darshan. He is more busy than usual, the same way most of us work more on a Sunday than on any other day. We have some service activity, akhanda bhajan or study circle. Everything happens on a Sunday, so we are busier. Therefore, we would like to relax on a working day! (Laughter) So the lesson is that He has not made any kind of change in His schedule or itinerary whatsoever.
Another lesson we can learn from Him is this. He has been telling us that we are not the body. We know theoretically that we are not the body. But on pizza day, I am the body! (Laughter) When I see a cup of ice cream, I am the body. When I see some South Indian pickles, yes, I am the body! (Laughter) So, we know theoretically that we are not the body, but we are the body when the situation arises.
We know that we are not the mind. Everyone says, “I am not the mind.” But again, it’s only theoretical. If you call that nonsense, the man gets angry. But if he truly is not the mind, why should he get angry? (Laughter) Theoretically he knows that he is not the mind; but in fact, he is totally the mind. The mind or ego reacts immediately because the mind is still highly sensitive. It is like gasoline – highly volatile.
When the ego is affected, it goes to any extent. If I don’t hear you, you are irritated. If I don’t follow you, you are annoyed. We don’t think about why you are like that. We don’t bother to step into another’s shoes and find out why someone is like that. We are only bothered about why he does not act according to our wish or why he does not conduct himself according to our desire. But we know theoretically that we are not the mind!
So, my friends, we know too much theory and nothing practical. I am sure you are noting down my words. I repeatedly say, “We know.” I don’t say, “You know.” I say, “We know”, which includes me too. I am the first on the list.
We know theoretically that we are neither the body nor the mind. Yet we react every time. So how can He convince us? How can He make us rally around? Here is an open demonstration. Imagine the terrible pain from an initial fracture, then the subsequent operation, then the next fall and next fracture. How is He able to bear that? How is He able to smile? How is He able to stand and give a discourse?
When He was perfectly fit, He gave a one hour lecture. Today He gives a one and a half hour lecture. Extra! How is it possible? Suppose I have pain, can I smile? If I have some problem, can I attend my office? How is He able to do that? The simple answer is that He is beyond the body. He is beyond the mind. So, it is an open demonstration to all of us that one can transcend the body and the mind like Him. Unless we see it operating, unless we see it in front of us, we cannot learn.
Some people ask why He does not cure Himself. If He cures Himself, we are the first persons to say, “You are God. You could cure Yourself. So how about curing me?”
If He does not cure Himself, some say, “How can You be God if You cannot cure Your own suffering?” We don’t spare anybody! (Laughter) We are always ready with questions. But when we stop these questions and accept, we will certainly learn many lessons.
Am I clear, sir? Yes. Any other question please?
Sir, just a few minutes back, you said that if everything is God’s Will then we have to accept sorrow or happiness with equanimity. What about Baba saying that we can change our destiny? If we keep quiet, can we change our destiny? And then, once again, He says that if any injustice is done to you and you keep quiet about it then you are as wrong or as guilty as the person who is unjust. Have we to accept everything meekly?
No, no, no, no, no! I am so happy that you brought up this fundamental question. It’s a very good question.
Baba said that you can change your destiny. Do we know our destiny? Destiny does not mean the goal I have set for myself. Destiny does not mean my imaginary end of life. Destiny does not mean my hypothetical ambition. Destiny is certainly not that which I have set for myself. Destiny is that which I do not know about. Destiny is not in my hands. So how are you going to change that which you do not know about, and that which is not in your hands?
If your destiny were known to you, you could change it. If changing destiny were in our hands, nobody would keep quiet. But I don’t know my destiny. And moreover, even if I think I know my destiny, it is only my mental pre-supposition. It may not be correct.
For example, I think my destiny is to get an interview. You may call that your destiny. But it is not! What is the actual destiny? To feel Him within is the reality. But I have got a notion of destiny in my head. My destiny is to give Him a flower. So, that idea of destiny is our definition. But the actual definition of destiny is beyond our comprehension. It is in the Divine hands. The question of changing our destiny is not in our hands either. That answers the first part of your question.
Let’s move on to the second part of your question: If any injustice is happening, is it not our duty to correct it? How does acceptance work here?
So here there are two aspects: one is at the individual level, and correcting injustice is at inter-relationship level. One is ‘inter’, while the other is ‘intra’. That which happens within me is ‘intra’, while that which relates to you is ‘inter’. Now, when there is injustice happening, it is interrelationship. I cannot bear any injustice. That’s what I think. For this, what am I to do?
What I consider injustice depends upon my own perception. I think it may be injustice but it may not truly be injustice. Here is a simple example. I had some problem in the university long ago. About 12 years ago, I had to face a challenge in life and pay heavily. There was a gross injustice -- you can ask anybody from Kashmir to Kanyakumari. Nobody will say it was justifiable.
You must know by now that I am an extrovert. I cannot keep anything to myself. Therefore, I am revealing to you my own personal example, in order to convince you of the reality. It is not just theoretical or imaginary.
Unexpectedly, the matter came up when Swami was there in Kodaikanal. I mentioned my incident to Swami without mentioning my name or the man who was responsible for this. I said that it was gross injustice for such a thing to happen. I did not say that I was put to injustice or who was responsible. It is gross injustice wherever it is, or whoever it has happened to.
Then, immediately Baba said, “How do you know it is injustice?”
“Swami, it is injustice by any standard.”
“It may be injustice from your point of view. But the man there, he knows whether it is justice or injustice. He doesn’t do it simply like that. How do you know it is injustice? This injustice that you have been put to may help you evolve later.”
What was done to Ramachandra was total injustice. He was the legal heir to the kingdom. To make the younger brother the king and to ask the elder brother to get out was gross injustice. Yet He allowed Himself to be put through that injustice. Why? This injustice glorified Him later. This injustice has shown His Divinity to the world. This injustice has made him an example to the rest of humanity. So we take justice or injustice at face value.
Actually speaking, it is the motive that decides it, not the action or reaction. To cut you with a knife is injustice. But when a doctor does it, it is not injustice. It is surgery. If I do it, I will be put behind bars. So, it is the motive that makes something just or unjust, not the action or anything on the face value of it.
Finally, I should ask first, “Am I justified correcting injustice? Let me see whether I lead the life of justice, of righteousness.” If I am clean, I will be able to point out injustice elsewhere. And if I reach that state of righteousness, I would not point it out. I would love him, try to change him, and try to transform him. I would not be reactive, revengeful, or retaliatory. I would love him, try to be soft with him, take pity upon him, try to convince him slowly, with all softness, tenderness, by setting an example, such that injustice corrects itself on its own.
Ultimately what happened in The Ramayana? All those who put Rama to injustice have come back to Him to seek pardon, admitting openly whatever they had done was total injustice.
Therefore, my friends, this subject can be looked at objectively from several different dimensions. I thank our sister for having brought this question up, which is very relevant and genuine. Thank you very much! Yes, any more? Yes sir, please.
If a person commits suicide, everybody says that he committed suicide. In Telugu, they say “Paapam! Atmahathya chesukunnadandi.” But according to Bhagavad Gita, Chapter 2, slokas 23 and 24:
Nainam chindanthi shastraani
Nainam dahati paavakah
Nainam kledayenthyapo
Na shoshayati marutah.
Mari atuvantappudu
Atmahathya antaaru,
yendukani?
Body hathya anaali kada.
The question is in Telugu. ‘Suicide’ is the English word. Its literal translation is ‘Atmahathya’ (murder of Atma). Though we use the word ‘Atmahathya’, it is completely wrong by any standard. So that every common man understands, the word ‘Atmahathya’ is used to mean suicide. It is used for general understanding only. But truly speaking, Atma, the true Self, cannot be put to hathya, or murdered. Impossible! You cannot kill Atma, the Self.
Nainam chindanthi shastraani
Nainam dahati paavakah
Nainam kledayenthyapo
Na shoshayati marutah.
That is the sloka. It means that the Self or Atma cannot be burnt, cannot be cut to pieces, cannot be made wet, cannot be drenched, cannot be washed away or swept off by the wind. The Self is undisturbed, unruffled, steady, constant, unaffected, blemish-less, immortal, nectarine, without a beginning or an end. So, Atmahathya is just a common notation, is just a common usage, but in reality it is totally wrong. Am I clear, sir?
Then, what do you mean by Atmahathya? What do you mean by suicide? It means putting an end to the body.
Here is a simple example. Long back in the ‘60s, one boy was very disappointed that Swami stopped speaking to him. He wanted to take poison and commit suicide. He sent a message to Swami in those days.
Then Baba said, “I’ll give him a new body, doesn’t matter. (Laughter) Perhaps he is bored with the present body. I’ll give him a new body; perhaps the new body will be more promising.”
So the point is, Atmahathya, in the general sense, means putting an end to life. But we are not putting an end to the life either. It is also wrong. Life is continuous. Life cannot be ended. One can only put an end to the body. That’s all. Am I clear, sir?
Any more questions, please? Yes sir, please come. Sir, you are from?
Sathyam Shivam Sundaram
I am from Kathmandu.
Kathmandu! Very good!
Last time I was here Kasturi had talked about our Baba as Sathyam Shivam and Sundaram. And many scriptures also point out that. I would like you to talk about Sathyam Shivam and Sundaram, as well as the beauty of our Baba. (Laughter)
Sathyam Shivam Sundaram – That is the song, isn’t it? Well, he wants to know what Sathyam Shivam Sundaram means. In fact, we need a complete talk on that subject. But some of you may feel that I want to escape from my responsibility. I am not given to that. At least God has given me enough of courage to say that I do not know. (To say, “I do not know” we need courage. To say, “I know”, one need not be courageous.)
But Sathyam Shivam Sundaram is such a popular phrase that all of us know about it. It is time to remind ourselves of that again. I am not telling you anything that you do not know. These are things that you might have forgotten; or even if you know, it doesn’t hurt to hear once again as they are so nice!
This morning I had one ice cream cup, so why not again? (Laughter) Good things can be remembered repeatedly. There is nothing wrong with it. Sathyam Shivam Sundaram . . . though each one of these requires one hour to speak on it, I would like to summarise by mentioning two points under each heading.
Sathyam is Truth. What is Truth? Truth is the eternal, constant, changeless, and immortal, which holds good for all the three periods of time -- past, present and future.
What is the condition in this universe? Everything is bound to change. When you go back to your place, you will find that things have changed. Many more houses are built, many more factories are coming up, more hospitals are coming up, and the city is becoming more polluted. So the place where we live undergoes so much change. Water is not as cool as it used to be. It is warm because of water pollution. Air is not as cool as before as it is polluted because of the release of smoke from the chimneys of factories.
So, my friends, everything is polluted. Earth is polluted, air is polluted, water is polluted, and food is polluted. Poison is also polluted. No one will die immediately (Laughter) as it takes time. All the antibiotics and capsules that we take for our problems will not work immediately. They are also polluted. There is less of the medicine and more advertising on the cover. (Laughter) So, everything is polluted.
If you come to Puttaparthi next time, you will find another building coming up. The building that did not exist six months ago is now showing its face, smiling at you. “Please watch the change in me!” Puttaparthi goes on changing! If those that stayed here 65 years ago were to come here now, they will either be unconscious or super-conscious or go mad, whichever happens first! (Laughter) The change here is so brisk! Every city is growing fast.
But there is one thing that does not change, that will not get polluted: that which is blemish-less, that which has neither a beginning nor an end. That is Divinity. Divinity is changeless or Sathyam. That’s what Sathyam means: changeless, eternal, immortal, blemish-less, only one Truth.
Secondly, Truth is one, not many. Religions may be many; people may be many. But Truth is one. Sugar is one, but so many sweets are ready in the North Indian canteen. (Of course, there is still time for you to get there! You can think of sweets a little later.) (Laughter) So many sweets are there in the North Indian canteen. The sugar quantity is different in different ones. But sugar and its sweetness are the same. They don’t say, “This sugar is for gulab jamun, while this sugar is for jangri, and this sugar is for laddu.” No! It’s all the same stuff.
Similarly, Truth is the One-without-a-second. It is the fundamental, basic Truth over which facts and other changeable, convertible, transforming situations and objects rest. That is Sathyam.
The second is Shivam. What do I mean by Shivam? Literally translated, Shivam means ‘goodness’. Sathyam Shivam Sundaram stands for Truth, Goodness and Beauty. Goodness is only an apology, an excuse of a translation. But Shivam is something more. Shivam is That, the consciousness, that which is Divine within you, the Self or Atma. Jiva is the individual, Atma is the Self. Jiva plus Atma, the individual plus the Self is Shivam. How do you say that?
The inquisitiveness, the curiosity to learn, is Shivam. I want to know this. I want to know that. What is that? What is it? How, why, where, when? Inquisitiveness, curiosity is Shivam. Again, Shivam is that particular awareness. I know that I am Anil Kumar. Who told you? I know! That awareness is Shivam. I know I am a human being. Nobody needs to tell me.
I know this is a microphone. I know that this is not a book. So, I know what it is. I also know what it is not. I think I am clear. This knowing is pragnya. This knowing is awareness. That’s what Shivam is. So, knowing does not mean only that which you know. Knowing also means to know what it is not. I know this; I also know what it is not. That is Shivam. I know this is sweet; I also know that it is not hot. Or, I know this is hot; I also know that it is not sweet. So, what it is, what it is not, is the knowing. That’s what we call awareness or pragnya, Shivam.
And third is Sundaram or beauty. We have forgotten beauty. We know the plastic, synthetic and chemical beauty. We do not know natural beauty. We love plastic flowers as we don’t know the real flowers. Some people have plastic mango leaves in front of their doors because the natural mango leaves have to be changed every day. If I keep plastic, it will remain with me. (Laughter)
We are used to artificial life; therefore we are cut off from natural beauty. Some people have fountains at their residences, and they brag about them. They are proud of it. What is this fountain when compared to the natural fountains (waterfalls) elsewhere? Go to Bhakra-Nangal project and see the waterfall; go to Somsamudra waterfall, Mettur Dam, Nagarjunsagar or the Niagara waterfall. You’ll have to fall in front of it in reverence. But we are thrilled with water flowing out of a pipe and call it a fountain! (Laughter) That is the lowest standard of life!
I am so happy with a neon bulb. What is it in front of the moonlight? I am happy with a few stones, large-size rocks that are kept there, calling it a rock garden. You are a rock! (Laughter) Why don’t you see the mountain there? Why don’t I see the trees on the mountain? How beautiful it is! When compared to that, what is my rock garden? Horrible!
I am so happy with my pop music, with loud sounds from instruments that make more noise than the singer himself! (Laughter) The singer’s voice is totally submerged in those instrumental sounds. All of a sudden, when rock music comes to a stop, we enjoy peace of mind. (Laughter) If we hear pop music every day, we’ll have auditory problems also! So, artificial beauty surrounds us today.
But the real beauty is in Nature. How beautiful a rainbow is! How beautiful the full moonlight is! How beautiful the running water of the river is! The cool breeze in the evening as you go for a walk -- how beautiful it is! Flowers moving in the wind -- how much more beautiful they are than our faces! (Laughter) Though I may feel that my face is the most beautiful, in front of a flower, I will realise (if I am honest) that I am ugly. Flowers are beautiful. So are mountains, rivers, valleys, birds.
A surgeon once told me how excellently planned the human body is. When they open the body, the arteries and the veins, everything works perfectly well. It is most beautiful. Sunita Williams’ statement from space is recorded where she talks about how beautiful the planet earth looks. We think it is useful to know about other planets, but we are more beautiful than that.
Somebody should tell you how beautiful you are. You think the neighbour is more beautiful. No, no. You are more beautiful. So, this original natural beauty is the creation of God. It is a reflection of God. That’s why it is said, Sarvam Vishnumayam Jagat. Sarvam means ‘everything’. Jagat means ‘the world’. Vishnumayam means ‘Divine’. So, the whole world, the whole universe is Divine. So, that which is beautiful is Divinity personified.
So, what is this Nature? God manifest is Nature. If God wants to manifest Himself, if God decides to show you how beautiful He is, He creates Nature. And if Nature wants to show you who God is, it is beauty. Therefore, Nature unmanifest is God, while God manifest is Nature.
So, life, Nature, the creation and Creator are not separate. The creation is a reflection of the Creator. Therefore, it is our duty to take care of the five elements, to see that the air is pure, to see that the water is pure, to see that the earth is pure, to see that the food is pure, and to see that the five elements are unpolluted. As creation is a reflection of the Creator, I cannot abuse or misuse it. If I do it, I have to suffer. I face the risk of my life. Floods and earthquakes are just reactions in Nature of man’s misuse or disuse of Nature. It is Nature’s way to get back at us.
Therefore, beauty means that which is pristine and pure. Beauty is not related to age. Some old people are more beautiful than youngsters. There is beauty in being old also. Suppose a 70-year old man wears jeans, a denim shirt and whistles on the street. He’ll be considered mad. (Laughter)
Let us not try to go against nature. Yes, I am old. I age gracefully. Can you imagine any saint in jeans? Can you imagine Vashishta or Viswamitra with a moustache or French-cut or barrel pants or with earring in one ear (Laughter) or with long hair? He is not a cowboy. So, it is natural for him to be like that.
A young man should look young and be young. An old man should look old and be old and graceful. Mind is ever young. Last night, Dev Anand spoke there on TV. He’s an 84-year old Bollywood film star. His manner of speaking was quite young, alert and smart, and he had a great memory. There is grace in being old also. So, the beauty that is beyond age, status, dignity, respectability or positions is the real beauty. Most of the film stars look horrible when they come out of the studio. (Laughter) That is artificial beauty. The makeup man makes them look beautiful on screen.
Therefore, Sundaram is that which is natural, and beyond age and geography. The real beauty lies in goodness. A person may be very beautiful, but number one in crookedness. A person may be very beautiful, but a rogue or cheat number one. So, beauty is not external. A person may look dark, but may be very good at heart. A person may be fair outside, but totally dark inside. So beauty relates to the inner beauty. That inner beauty is culture. That inner beauty is conviction. That inner beauty gives you the value of life. That inner beauty is a combination of your character, virtue and thought. That is Sundaram.
Sathyam Shivam Sundaram - that is the quintessence of these three things. Bhagavan is Sathyam because He is changeless. Many people say Swami, “You are same, but we have changed.”
It is natural. Even our own students have put on so much weight that doors have to be widened. We change naturally, but Bhagavan is changeless. What He says is always true - Sathya. He repeats it even to this day. Some people wonder why Swami repeats the same thing. Truth is repeated.
Why should the sunrise be repeated? No! Let there not be sunrise this morning. (Laughter) Why should the sunset be repeated? Let us see what happens if there is no sunset. Why is day to be repeated? Let us see, keep it dark totally. Therefore, my friends, things are repeated. That repetition is the nature of Truth because it is changeless.
Baba speaks of love, love, love. Somebody asked why Swami speaks of love every time? He does it because you have not yet cultivated that quality of love. You know love, you’ve heard about love. But you don’t love anybody. You don’t have that lovingness. You don’t have that loveliness. You know what love is. What for? So, until I enjoy love, until I become love myself, He is not tired of repeating any number of times. So it is not repetition. Truth is changeless. Baba is Sathyam.
Secondly Shivam, which is awareness. Baba has complete understanding and awareness. He is not merely a philosopher. He knows engineering, medicine, geography, history, everything. We know certain things. We know things halfway. Incomplete knowledge is dangerous. Complete understanding is awareness. So, Sai is Shivam.
Finally, let’s talk about Baba as Sundaram. Well, I don’t have to say how beautiful it is to watch Swami! If He is not beautiful, we won’t wait for Him right from 6:30 till 9:30. Though the darshan is cancelled, we are ready to go there again by two o’ clock. Why? Though we have seen Him in the morning and evening, when He goes outside, we run after His car. Why? What is that attraction?
It is because of His beauty or Sundaram. Particularly when He adjusts His hair, when His hair is tossed by the touch of the wind -- it is a sight for the gods! (Laughter) So beautiful! And with two fingers, He collects His hair like that. (Laughter) It is so nice to watch Him. And how He adjusts His dress in a tender way, in a very sensitive way, as He doesn’t want His Feet to be seen by everybody. He doesn’t want His whole arm to be exposed. How nice! As He walks . . . so beautiful! He doesn’t run and He doesn’t drag. He floats. Nataraj. It is a feast to watch Him.
How does He eat? He doesn’t seize the dal with five fingers and mix with the food. (Laughter) He nicely uses His fingertips. And we don’t find any food item around His lips or on the tips of His fingers. There is no sound as He eats. As some people eat, the whole row can listen to the sound. (Laughter) Elephants are better than such people who don’t have any dining manners. And nothing slips off of His plate. That’s beauty. Style is the man. Handsome is as handsome does. Whatever He does -- His style of walking, His style of dress, His style of eating, His style of talking, His voice, His tone, His subject -- everything is beautiful!
Madhuradhipathe Akhilam Madhuram.
Madhuradhipathe Akhilam Madhuram.
Hasanam Madhuram
Venu Madhuram
Vedam Madhuram
Madhuradhipathe Akhilam Madhuram.
Of all that is madhuram or sweet, the sweetest is Truth, Beauty, and Goodness - Sathyam Shivam Sundaram. Is that OK, sir? Thank you. Thank you very much! (Applause)
Just wait. Any other questions, please? Yes, please come. You can put a question, yes. Ladies have had less representation, so let her have a chance. You are from? Chennai! That’s great. Good.
“Om Sri Sai Ram. I have the same question as aunty has. I need a small clarification. Like aunty mentioned, bearing with injustice is not good. But I tend to follow Swami’s instructions to give more love or shower more love on somebody who hates you. But, from a practical point of view, any person or any professional or any elder says that I am doing the wrong thing. You have to fight injustice.”
Correct. My only answer was, when I say that someone is wrong, that person should not say there are so many things wrong with me. Do I have a right to say that the other person is wrong? The other person will say that I am wrong in other instances. That is point one.
Secondly, when I say that someone else is wrong, am I prepared to correct myself when the correct thing is given to me? Also, before I say that someone is wrong, I should take into consideration his age, his position, his experience, and his circumstances.
Thank you very much.
Did somebody else say they have a question? Thank you. Good, good, good . . . quite encouraging!
Sai Ram. Basically, this is regarding life beyond death. You just mentioned an anecdote about a student. In a similar manner, we believe that the present life is based on our past deeds. And based on the deeds of this life, you will your next birth will be assigned. My question is: If a person lives an ideal life, my understanding based on what I have read is that based on your deeds, you reach heaven. Similarly if you are not that idealistic in your performance, you go to hell. Having reached heaven, the pleasure of living in heaven lasts only till your karma or your time allotted there is over and then again you are re-born. So, is this a never-ending cycle? Are we going to be exposed to this time and again -- that you have to take birth, perform, go to heaven or hell, finish your deeds there and be reborn? So, is there no redemption at all?
That’s great! (Applause) Thank you. You are from? Bombay? Uh...huh…good, good! Enlightened city! Good.
You used three words: moksha, heaven and hell. These three words figured in your question. What does Swami say about it? There is no heaven anywhere. There is no hell anywhere. If there is heaven somewhere, Sunita Williams would have gone there! (Laughter) If there is hell somewhere, Neil Armstrong would have gone there and given a complete, detailed report of all the things happening there. And we would have gone in large numbers to fight with those fellows living in hell and to see that hell is made into heaven.
So, hell is not anywhere else. If heaven was separate, we would be ready to buy a ticket. Intercontinental Ballistic Missile! (Laughter) Zoom! Go to the heaven! So my point is that Baba has never said that there is a heaven and a hell.
Swargamanangaveru suralokamuna ledu,
Swargamanagaveru suralokamuna ledu.
Paradise or heaven is not separate. No! That heaven is within you. This is heaven -- talking to you, all of us meeting together, thinking of Swami with spiritual interest, dropping all our narrow mindedness downstairs (of course, which we will pick up later while collecting our shoes outside as we leave, assuming (Laughter) they are still intact). Right now, we are above all our narrow mindedness, all considerations past! We are just one brotherhood, one fraternity. Thinking of Swami, we are not worried about our health problems, income tax problems, business problems, family problems. We are above them. This is heaven. So heaven has no separate existence of its own.
Now, let us say that I am miserable; I am very sad. Therefore, I have a long face. I don’t feel like eating or sleeping or singing. That is worse than hell. So, heaven and hell are right now, right here. Our condition will decide whether we are in heaven or hell.
Secondly, if we do good deeds, we can get into heaven. When that period of happiness lapses, (something like a life insurance policy), we have to return. What you said has scriptural support. I cannot make fun of it.
Punyam ksheene madhya lokam avisham vishanti.
The Bhagavad Gita has clearly said that once the merit is cleared, we have to return. Correct? So, why should we go there to that place from where we have to return, anyway? I stay there in a seven-star hotel, or a five-star hotel. After some days, I have to leave and go back to my staff quarters, which are light-proof and wind-proof (Laughter) and more fit for cockroaches and rats! (Laughter) That is my reality. I have to leave that seven-star hotel some day. Therefore, why should I desire that which I have to eventually leave? Not necessary.
Even hell is not permanent. I am not going to be in hell eternally. It could be two years or three years or any other time, depending upon Yama Dharmaraja’s penal code (Laughter). He has got his own penal code - YPC. It’s not IPC, Indian Penal Code; it is YPC, Yama Penal Code. (Laughter) So, according to that, he will put me in hell for two years or four years. Then he will release me. But, if I do the same thing, then I go back there. Eventually, we’ll have a situation where we are happier in hell because all our colleagues are there! (Laughter) Very few go to heaven. So the miserable state, the sorrowful state is hell. It is not a separate place.
There is one text, a Purana by the name of Garuda Purana, where they describe hell. It seems big pans are there and all these fellows will be fried like papad. (Laughter) Just imagine what the size of the kitchen would then be (Laughter) -- at least billions of times bigger than the South Indian canteen! (Laughter) And Garuda Purana also says that these fellows will be drawn on the tips of the knives. So how many knives will there be? How many swords will be there? With increasing population, Yama Dharmaraja must be extending his kitchen (Laughter) because he has to fry all these people.
A beginner, an illiterate, a rustic person is given an elaborate story so that he may not commit mistakes, so that he may do good deeds. A simple thing: we have Ramayana in pictures for a change. I don’t read that picture album now. If I read that, people will say that something is wrong with me. I can be like a child, but I cannot be childish. To be childish is a curse. To be a child is a virtue. So, pictorial Ramayana is for the child. Textual Ramayana is for the adult. The significant Ramayana, Adhyatma Ramayana written by Vyasa, with all the spiritual interpretation (not merely narration) is for the wise man or the seeker.
So similarly, the concept of heaven and hell is for innocent, ignorant people so that they will be righteous, so that they will understand. If I say everything is within you, they will say, “Keep it within you; let me go away from here.” Am I clear? That’s what it is.
So my friends, the time is up. We will meet next time. Thank you very much for being here. I am overjoyed! (Applause) Your questions are so challenging, interesting, and thought-provoking. Your questions are searching. Your questions will make everybody to go into the depth of one’s own knowledge and of Sai literature, to bring out the facts and the truths. You have helped us all. I really thank those who have liberally come forward with questions.
The answer is the question. The question is the answer. We cannot take the question in the normal sense of a question. If I say that you are a questionable man, what does question mean there? Questionable means something is fishy or something is wrong with you. “He has a questionable character” means there is something wrong with him.
But our questions are not like that. Our question, every question, is an answer. Every answer is a question. Everything is implied, everything is compiled, and everything is combined. May God bless you! Thank you very much. (Applause)
OM
Asato Maa Sad Gamaya
Tamaso Maa Jyotir Gamaya
Mrtyormaa Amrtam Gamaya
Om Loka Samastha Sukhino Bhavantu
Loka Samastha Sukhino Bhavantu
Loka Samastha Sukhino Bhavantu
Om Shanti Shanti Shanti